ThunderCats Episode 16 "Trials of Lion-O Part 2" OFFICIAL TALKBACK THREAD

I felt this was a better episode than the last two. Lion-O did well, and I was surprised by him sacrificing his actual soul. It was also good to see Kit finally use her flupe again and be useful. I was a little confused when she mentioned the elephants talking about a soul. Seemed like forced foreshadowing. The fight at the end with Mumm-Ra started out pretty well, but I was disappointed it just ended with him getting blasted and fleeing.

Good idea, like I said it was only a very quick last minute idea this time. We’ll have to do that for next week!

It was a decent episode, but it should have been so much better. Everything after the Tygra Trial just felt so rushed. It’s a shame Panthro’s stretchy arms had to make an appearance.

I really would’ve liked to see a moment between Tygra and Lion-O other than Tygra calling him “Your majesty”. Even just a silent hug when Lion-O rescued them would have been great.

It makes no sense whatsoever. The Generals are trapped and Mumm-Ra is retreating? Let’s run away! All they were fighting was worthless lizard warriors, just finish them off and end the war. Obviously there wouldn’t be a show if they defeated Mumm-Ra, but at least make it so the main bad guy isn’t a total weakling.

The sword doesn’t do that in the new series, not yet at least.

I think two reasons, first I don’t think the sword is the strangely all powerful weapon that could do ANYTHING like it could in the OS, and second I think it is because liono is still developing and growing and learning about the sword, I don’t think either of their full power has come to light yet, not to say it won’t though.

I’ve not seen the episode yet. However the one thing that bugs me about the new series is the fact Mumm-Ra was extremely threatening and evil in the first 2 episodes but since then he’s gradually become weaker and does not appear that often. When he does appear he’s all bluster, transforms then gets beaten back quite easily. Which happened in the OS but not before Mumm-Ra had hatched a plan and it almost paid off. Not in the new series so much. Lion-O and Mumm-Ra have both been used poorly so far, after a pretty strong opening in the first few episodes. I understand that Lion-O is on a journey, but he does not appear to remember the lessons he learned in earlier episodes. One step forward, 4 steps back. Otherwise I have been enjoying the show.

I feel like this would have worked better as at least a 3 parter because it felt pretty rushed. Panthro’s trial, Lion-O getting to the Pyramid, Mumm-Ra’s removal of the Eye ceremony, the T-Cats’ rescue, and the final fight all felt quickly run through. And I would have liked to have seen more of The Generals as well.

But it was still a fun episode. There was never a dull moment and it was consistently entertaining throughout. I think my favorite part of the whole thing was Wily Kit’s faith that Lion-O would return. It really did set her apart from the rest of the group, even her own brother, as a character. And even though we didn’t see much of it, I thought the ceremony Mumm-Ra was performing gave off a good creepy vibe. Even the blackened sky surrounding the Pyramid brought out an atmosphere more akin to the Pyramid of the original series.

As for Lion-O’s trials, I think I see what the writers were going for here. The OS trials were designed to test Lion-O’s skills and not so much his character. But carrying off of what I said last week, I really have no idea what he was supposed to get out of Panthro’s trial. To have a commanding presence? I mean that had to be the easiest task ever. It really reminded me of Labyrinth when they had that scene on the bridge where Ditimus wouldn’t let them through and in the end, all they had to do was ask his permission. Awfully simple, but that was played for laughs. This just just seemed too easy and again, I have no idea what Lion-O was supposed to learn except being bossy.

Now the Tygra trial was brilliant. I have a theory on this, but I believe that the trial was designed to be impossible for Lion-O to win. I believe that the test was to see how Lion-O would handle defeat (Kobayashi-Maru anyone?) and the real trial was about him wanting to put the others before himself to make up for his mistake in part 1. So yeah, the Trials I didn’t find overly impressive except for the last one, and once again, Lion-O has yet to beat Tygra. Maybe part of it is that Lion-O has to learn that he doesn’t have to be better at Tygra in combat to be King. That’s another idea to play with.

In comparing to the OS though, I have to give the nod to them for having the better Anointment Trials. It was a more epic story with a more satisfying conclusion. I think its fair to compare the two as its obvious that is where this Two Parter drew its inspiration. Lion-O faces the T-Cats 1 by 1 in various trials, he takes something from them (keys instead of insignias this time), he faces Mumm-Ra at the end, and he does it all without the Sword of Omens. But in the end, I felt like the OS one did a better job of explaining what tests were and making the episodes more exciting. Of course they also had 5 episodes instead of 2, so yeah.

All of the Trials seemed to be variations of the same lesson - think before you act. It’s pretty lame that they didn’t use the Trials to their full potential, but that is a lesson Lion-O sorely needed.

Now the Tygra trial was brilliant. I have a theory on this, but I believe that the trial was designed to be impossible for Lion-O to win. I believe that the test was to see how Lion-O would handle defeat (Kobayashi-Maru anyone?) and the real trial was about him wanting to put the others before himself to make up for his mistake in part 1.

That’s how I interpreted it as well. :cool:

In comparing to the OS though, I have to give the nod to them for having the better Anointment Trials. It was a more epic story with a more satisfying conclusion

Absolutely. The new series did a great job implementing the Trials in an interesting way, but the execution wasn’t all that great.

I have much to say about this episode but for now for the sake of time I will say man did I ROTFL when Tygra said “whiskers.”

I agree this would have been better as a 3 parter but that’s not a negative on the show just a reflection on the constraints of a short cartoon time slot. Of course certain things will feel rushed, its a shame I agree but its the nature of things unfortunately. Like I said in another post I would LOVE each episode to be a 2 hour film to fit everything in, but that won’t happen.

I agree though that wilykit was given a lovely and subtle character development here. I liked thatm

With tygras trial it was really more about self belief than anything.

My thoughts on the episode:

  1. Thank goodness Monkian is actually speaking like Monkian and not a refined gentleman from 1800’s London.

  2. Panthro’s stretchy arms never appearing in the show again would be too soon.

  3. Mummra is turning into a bigger p$##y(no cat pun intended lol) in this series than the old one. His gameplan everytime seems to be transform(with reused animation :eek: ) , fire a couple purple lightning bolts, and then promptly get pwned by Lion-o’s spirit stone and/or sword of omens.

  4. I thought the ideas behind all the trials were really great, but agree that they felt rushed/passed over too quickly. I agree with everyone else that said this should have been a 3 parter.

  5. The ending animation of Lion-o fighting Mummra was AWESOME, I wish the entire show had that kind of detail and frame rate, but I’m being picky.

  6. I’ll try and help coordinate tweeting for future episodes so that we can get more coordinated as a fan base.

  7. Overall I really liked the episode outside of Mummra being a complete weakling and Panthro’s go go gadget arms, while a bit rushed, it helped develop Lion-o and his relationships to the other cats and really set him in stone as THE KING. So hopefully we won’t have to deal as much with that in the future and can focus on each individual storyline coming up.

I agree that they should have split Lion_O trials in three episoses. The trial storlyline had enough potential for at least 3 parts. Anyway I enjoyed watching it.

Lion-O act great in this episode, he beat the three generals and Mumm-Ra alone and has proven that he is the king. I think it’s was okay for the trial final, but I hope he won’t become the ultimate supercat like in the OS.

It happened what I expected, Tygra made some ‘bad’ decissions and thinks he is not a good leader and blames himself. I hope everybody understand now that he loves his brother.

I liked this episode a lot! Lion-O didn’t **** me off at all!

My only problem was the Panthro trial. I felt like it justified all of those times Lion-O pulled rank on the team. It also takes away from the, you can still learn from your friends moral. It was really odd coming from spirit Panthro, because Panthro was the one to tell him he would have to earn his servitude, not just bark out orders.

Tygra trial was great. It illustrates that Tygra is not the source of all of Lion-O’s problems (like half of the fandom thinks) Lion-O is his own worse enemy. If he can’t control his emotions, than he cant be objective or make unbiased choices.

Tygra didn’t do all bad as leader. Don’t like how they made him act so much like Lion-O. I was hoping it would be an opportunity for Tygra to learn why Lion-O makes a better leader. How is that accomplished by having Tygra make the same bone headed mistakes? Though he does seem to be ahead as far as strategy . He made a good show of getting the cats into the pyramid, so I guess stealth is his greatest strength :slight_smile:

Oh Kit, you were to presh. You broke my heart, and then put it back together again.

I agree about the dynamic being different, but that just might be a product of the writer. It seemed like everyone was a bit more included than usual no? I’m not sure it was meant to illustrate anything particular. Will was probably just a tad more conscious of the other team members.

Lion-O really shined through this episode. I really feel like the lessons were implemented into the second half of the episode.
8.5/10

Watched it now and it was really great. Of course some more fleshed out story would have been good, but the creators still did a very good job with the little time they had.

I’ve seen the episode and I thought it worked pretty well given the show’s time constraints. Lion-O showed a mix of his youthful arrogance and actually learning something. I think Panthro stopping Lion-O going after Mumm-Ra was a wise decision, leaping into the dark with Mumm-Ra probably wouldn’t have worked out that well.
They could have spanned this across more episodes, but I guess they want to move the story along.

Happily their were not as many glaring holes this episode as there were last week. However I am really curious as to Kits music. I mean wow those lizards were out in a sec and suffered Amnesia afterwards. Heck of an ability. Wonder Why she does not use it more often?

I do agree that Mumm-Ra gave up too easily. A simple line like this ritual has drained me so you got lucky this time. Albeit cheesy but it would have made it seem less like he is a world class woos. Of course another way to go would have been to make Lion-O somehow invulnerable due to his daylong resurrection. Mumm-Ra Realizing this would make it logical for him to run to fight another day.

Whiskers! #(&$!@ it’s back and personally as much as I hate to say this Lion-O said it better.

I did like Tygras self realization in the cell that maybe being King is not all it’s cracked up to be. and that Lion-O did a pretty decent job considering the pressure. It is always easy to say “oh I could do that better.” until you actually have to do it. Now that he has had a taste of the responsibility I think he is gonna lay off Lion-O and go with the flow a bit more. Not to mention that Lion-O has now been given a Glowing Endorsement by the Grand Ghost of Jaga. That has got to buy him some points and if Tygra ever tries to gloat that Lion-O still could not beat him even in his own head at least Lion-O can now come back with “well have you ever Died and come back? No! Then Shhhhh.” Ahhhhhh Brothers.

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I agree, he wasn’t a bad leader, but he thinks that he didn’t do well.
Didn’t Lion-O use the same strategy at the end as Tygra before with doing a surprise attack?

I would have liked to see how Tygra would have used the sword, but I guess we will never see it.[/FONT]

Tygra wasn’t a bad leader, but he really wasn’t any better than Lion-O, that was the point. He probably could have figured a way out but he’s so unaccustomed to failure his brain kind of shuts down. Lion-O is used to screwing up and thinking on the fly.

Oh I forgot one thing I really did like was the New Growling sounds they had coming from Lion-O in a couple of scenes. When I heard that I thought wow no his is really getting Peeved. :smiley:

Even the playing field

THe lizards are so inept. As soon as Monkian & Jackalman were imprisoned it was all over. Losing Grune was huge for Mumm-ra’s side. No grune, no stones, no sword of his own. I think he we will continue to add new members to his team and he will get his sword back to even the playing field because right now he has no chance (way too easy to defeat).

I was just talking about this. I love when they incorporate more animalistic behaviors and sounds. Yeah, its a humanoid cat, but its still cat like. So the growling and snarling is always a nice touch. I also liked it when spirit Cheetara used her claws to help run in the 2nd trial.

Call my coo-coo, but I want to hear Lion-O roar before everything is said and done.